Curse

high priestess anya · Nov 29, 2009, 02:51 PM // 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by l Alucard l

Lets be real here,

Those complaining about SF

A. Suck and can't do it
B. Too lazy to make a sin
C. Just like to QQ
D. All of the above

Honestly if you dont like SF DONT PLAY IT! And if you have a perma and still want it nerfed ur either a liar or you suck at it.

Keep SF, if you dont use it then dont use it. QQ over a video game with an imaginary economy moar plz

Read my post...
I set records for many speedclears, i am extremely competent in every type of build for these runs. I taught people how to SF tank for DOA and i have always hated SF.
I use it because its a means to an end although i have always seen it as unecessary, overpowered. If anet hadnt been so daft as to create a god build in the first place we wouldnt be having this discussion.
No one man should be more powerful than the next. Its that simple.

Zebideedee · Nov 29, 2009, 03:17 PM // 15:17

Quote:

A. Suck and can't do it
B. Too lazy to make a sin
C. Just like to QQ
D. All of the above

You forgot E. Like to play fair and not cheat!

Blobbob · Nov 29, 2009, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay Vert

Actually it is the reverse. The only reason why UW is hard to complete for most players now is because of the changes ANet made to it in a failed attempt to limit the damage that Broken Form has been doing to the game for so long. Fix Broken Form then revert UW back to the former dificulty levels.

Actually I was talking about hard to get titles, which is an entirely different beast than UW.

l Alucard l · Nov 29, 2009, 06:31 PM // 18:31

"No one man should be more powerful than the next. Its that simple. "

Make a perma boom equality

My New Name · Nov 29, 2009, 10:06 PM // 22:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by high priestess anya

Read my post...
I set records for many speedclears, i am extremely competent in every type of build for these runs. I taught people how to SF tank for DOA and i have always hated SF.
I use it because its a means to an end although i have always seen it as unecessary, overpowered. If anet hadnt been so daft as to create a god build in the first place we wouldnt be having this discussion.
No one man should be more powerful than the next. Its that simple.

so what you're saying is...
you're a hypocrite?

UnChosen · Nov 29, 2009, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay Vert

Actually it is the reverse. The only reason why UW is hard to complete for most players now is because of the changes ANet made to it in a failed attempt to limit the damage that Broken Form has been doing to the game for so long. Fix Broken Form then revert UW back to the former dificulty levels.

Even before Anet did anything the area was hard to complete. Before UWSC people just did smite solo farms or duo farm instead, and non-guild groups was still the only people who can complete the area with any sort of consistency.

The problem are the gimmicks. All the quests need an explicit instruction like "don't begin this quest until you cleared X" so that pugs can actually know what's going on, and not just grab the quest and have monsters spawn on some important NPC or the players and wipe the group.

Then reduce the damage of those damn aataxes. Almost every single group wipe that I had been in was due to that monsters....a dumb ele moved too far forward (or scattered the mob), the aataxes don't aggro tank and go to back line, 2 hit KO everyone in less than 5 second while the monk fumble for prot spirit, and group wipe.

Reformed · Nov 29, 2009, 11:15 PM // 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnChosen

All the quests need an explicit instruction like "don't begin this quest until you cleared X" so that pugs can actually know what's going on, and not just grab the quest and have monsters spawn on some important NPC or the players and wipe the group.

In a competent group it actually makes sense to have 2 of the Labyrinth quests (Escort+UWG) running concurrently after you prep and it speeds up the clear a bit. I know what you are saying and am shocked people still run to the Reaper and "accept all" 4+ years in. There shouldn't be a fail button down there but that's part of the challenge (read: bad design). I wouldn't change the Aatxes though...there is something hysterical about a normal monster that can 2 shot most characters. That, and if your tank is so horrible at corner blocking they can't even hold 2-3 Aatxes on a stairwell the group probably won't be able to beat the UW anyways.

FyrFytr998 · Nov 30, 2009, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by high priestess anya

Read my post...
I set records for many speedclears, i am extremely competent in every type of build for these runs. I taught people how to SF tank for DOA and i have always hated SF.
I use it because its a means to an end although i have always seen it as unecessary, overpowered. If anet hadnt been so daft as to create a god build in the first place we wouldnt be having this discussion.
No one man should be more powerful than the next. Its that simple.

So do all the QQ's go away if they revert back and make all classes able to maintain SF? I think I'm on the right track here. That was one reason Ursan was working for a hot minute. It allowed all classes to get together in a cohesive build. Until the Douches started in with rank req's.

And as I stated before. People that talk about "it's the principle of it" forget that principles are subjective to one's own personal definition too. It just so happens that this time ANET is once again going the way of the QQ "Purists" and busting out the nerf bat. I wonder what everyone is gonna cry about next? I can just see it.

"Hey. They need to nerf consets. I've been playing since Proph and I defeated all the campaigns without them. I'm tired of all these noobs clearing my high end areas I worked so hard to do with no help."

Again, I'm neither pro or anti. I am very much for letting people enjoy GW how they see fit.

ShadowsRequiem · Nov 30, 2009, 12:19 AM // 00:19

awesome maybe i'll actually start playing again...

Artinnia · Nov 30, 2009, 03:31 AM // 03:31

To those that have proposed the idea of giving Perma SF to all professions... it won't accomplish much me thinks. You'll end up with a few varieties of Perma's after that.

1 .The Melee Perma following the route of the Scythe wielding Sins of UWSC,
2. The spell caster/tank Perma that uses Standard of Honor and Sliver Armor at 16 Earth Magic
3. The runner perma who uses SF just to run past everything.

I've sat on my Rit for almost the whole day playing on her with this thought in the back of my head... and you know what I can't think of a single build that would really work for her. Could Spirit Spam I guess, but the energy required wouldn't let me keep SF up, and the Spirits could get killed in AoE easily.

Sadly, I think you'd end up with an Ursan type situation again with people looking for only Sin, Derv (Scythe Wielders), or Ele Permas. So that really isn't a solution either.

Zahr Dalsk · Nov 30, 2009, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Artinnia

Could Spirit Spam I guess, but the energy required wouldn't let me keep SF up, and the Spirits could get killed in AoE easily.

Spirit Siphon leaves loads of extra energy.

Dark Paladin X · Nov 30, 2009, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Well, assassins are virtually useless in PvE scenarios and I find maintaing Shadow Form to be a big blessing that makes Assassins very useful (in addition to farming holiday items and gold rarity weapons for Wisdom Title).

In PvP, however, assassins are something that you shouldn't screw with.

BlackSephir · Nov 30, 2009, 05:21 AM // 05:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Paladin X

Well, assassins are virtually useless in PvE scenarios

I'm so confused. We're talking about assassins, not dervishes.

UnChosen · Nov 30, 2009, 07:08 AM // 07:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

I'm so confused. We're talking about assassins, not dervishes.

He means non-shadow form assassins. Normal assassins in PvE has a shitload of damage with the right skill bar, but doesn't change the fact that when there are stuff like bladed aatxe that does 300 dmg to the backline, you want melee characters that can tank well. Therefore, warriors get chosen over sins and dervs. Both the sins and dervs need their own version of dolyak signet and tanking stances :P

reaper with no name · Nov 30, 2009, 07:17 AM // 07:17

This is why prot was invented.

Lishy · Nov 30, 2009, 07:19 AM // 07:19

Since when were sins squishy? That have great insignias and decent armor. Not only that, but with Critical Agility, they're on par, if not, more than a warrior.

What difference does it make whether the assassin or aatxe gets hit anyways. Both will still die.

Non-SF assasssins are fine. Although maybe they could have a few more toys to play with in addition.

Faer · Nov 30, 2009, 07:33 AM // 07:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnChosen

Then reduce the damage of those damn aataxes. Almost every single group wipe that I had been in was due to that monsters....a dumb ele moved too far forward (or scattered the mob), the aataxes don't aggro tank and go to back line, 2 hit KO everyone in less than 5 second while the monk fumble for prot spirit, and group wipe.

Don't make the content easier because your Monk isn't good enough. Bring a better Monk. For that matter, don't bring stupid players that run into the frontlines with 60AL.

UnChosen · Nov 30, 2009, 07:34 AM // 07:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

This is why prot was invented.

Pugs don't like builds that require too much reliance on another person on the team for efficiency, it just leads to frustration when you get some noob monk that don't have the reflex to prot correctly. Sorry I hold the view that everything in the game should be balanced around pug skill level and not PvP guild skill level.

Though now that the ER infuse + prot spam eles are becoming more mainstream I also see that sins are finally getting better acceptance, because pugs know that the ER eles can upkeep everything without fail.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kain Fz

Since when were sins squishy? That have great insignias and decent armor. Not only that, but with Critical Agility, they're on par, if not, more than a warrior.

What difference does it make whether the assassin or aatxe gets hit anyways. Both will still die.

Non-SF assasssins are fine. Although maybe they could have a few more toys to play with in addition.

Can't get anywhere near the 80+20+16(shield)+42(dolyak signet)+20(Obsidian flesh)+damage reduction(stoneflesh aura)+block(stances)+600HP (signet of stamina, endure pain)

It maybe ridiculously stale and slow but I rather get into a pug that runs something like that than having a monk lag and miss a prot and have the sin collapse in less than a sec.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theocrat

Don't make the content easier because your Monk isn't good enough. Bring a better Monk. For that matter, don't bring stupid players that run into the frontlines with 60AL.

Its not Anet's fault for shitty design, its the player's fault for not being lucky (or psychic) enough to find a good monk!...*roll eyes* By the way, no monk in the entire game can prot spirit more than one char at a time...if 3 aatxe go for 3 different characters (it happens), the monk still can't do anything.

Faer · Nov 30, 2009, 07:38 AM // 07:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnChosen

Its not Anet's fault for shitty design, its the player's fault for not being lucky enough to find a good monk!.....*roll eyes*

It's not shitty design. It has worked fine, and been easy to deal with, for years. Don't blame ArenaNet for your team being terrible. This game is about teamwork. Don't want to fail? Then bring a good team.

And by the way, there are more prots in this game than Prot Spirit. You can, you know, use them, to like, mitigate damage, and like, not die to dumb shit at the start of UW. Even Heroes can handle monking in UW. If you're dying, your team needs to stop being shit.

UnChosen · Nov 30, 2009, 07:45 AM // 07:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theocrat

It's not shitty design. It has worked fine, and been easy to deal with, for years. Don't blame ArenaNet for your team being terrible. This game is about teamwork. Don't want to fail? Then bring a good team.

And by the way, there are more prots in this game than Prot Spirit. You can, you know, use them, to like, mitigate damage, and like, not die to dumb shit at the start of UW.

Or you can get your "pro" team and get out of here. The game's too easy for you? Quit, and go play another game. These type of flamebait illogical argument doesn't help the game one bit. By the way I do have a damn good team in my guild, I just prefer to have a game where I am not stuck playing in the same few hours everyday with the same group of people.